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'berto
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Posted: Nov 02, 2006 10:12 Post subject: COL: evangelical homophobe denies gay affair

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He says he'll have his church investigate the claims.... yeah, riiiight

Quote:
The leader of one of Colorado's most popular mega-churches, Ted Haggard, said his church would investigate allegations from a male prostitute that Haggard solicited gay sex, 9News reported Wednesday.

Haggard, the founder and senior leader of the 14,000-member New Life Church in Colorado Springs and president of the multimillion- member National Association of Evangelicals, denied the accusations raised by the prostitute to KUSA- Channel 9. But the pastor said he is prepared for his own church to investigate the claims.

Male escort Mike Jones of Denver started talking to 9 Wants to Know two months ago, making claims that he has had a three-year sexual business relationship with Haggard, the station reported.

Jones went public about their alleged relationship Wednesday morning on talk radio.

"People may look at me and think what I've done is immoral, but I think I had to do the moral thing in my mind and that is expose someone who is preaching one thing and doing the opposite behind everybody's back," Jones told 9News.

[...]

"I've never had a gay relationship with anybody, [Haggard said.] "I am steady with my wife. I'm faithful to my wife. I don't know if this is election-year politics or if this has to do with the marriage amendment or what it is," Haggard said.

[...]

Haggard has been one of the major proponents for a state constitutional ban on gay marriage.

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Feral
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Posted: Nov 02, 2006 10:44 Post subject:

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Curious.

It would be rather difficult to actually have a 3-year business relationship of this sort without producing evidence. Much depends upon the nature of Mr. Jone's work -- I have no idea whether he is a $20 hustler or a credited $600 porn star. There is also the question of the character of his employment -- this professional relationship had to take place somewhere, and I doubt it was Mr. Haggard's home. One would also have to wonder, if the allegations are correct, if there are more professionals who might have something to say about this story. Or am I to assume that there is something special about Mr. Jones that produces loyal customers?

The television station's reporting on this matter is here.
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Feral
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Posted: Nov 02, 2006 15:06 Post subject:

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Rocky Mountain News

Quote:
Jones also said during his appearance with Boyles that he was paid money by Haggard, who made frequent trips to Denver for sexual liaisons, that he has recorded voicemails and a letter from Haggard, and that he had also witnessed Haggard use methamphetamine.

Jones offered to take a polygraph examination concerning his claim, and Boyles said that will occur Friday during his morning radio show.

Huh.

You don't say.

Voicemails and a letter.

Well that would certainly be untidy of Mr. Haggard, if true.
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Feral
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Posted: Nov 02, 2006 15:18 Post subject:

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FOF chair James Dobson rushed to Haggard's defense on Thursday.

Quote:
"It is unconscionable that the legitimate news media would report a rumor like this based on nothing but one man's accusation," Dobson said in a statement.

"Ted Haggard is a friend of mine and it appears someone is trying to damage his reputation as a way of influencing the outcome of Tuesday's election -- especially the vote on Colorado's marriage-protection amendment -- which Ted strongly supports."

Tut tut tut... it's an allegation, not a rumor. One man's accusation is what some of us like to call eyewitness testimony. I'm all a-twitter to hear what Mr. Haggard is supposed to have said on Mr. Jones' voice-mail. Somehow I doubt its anything like "don't be late for church."

Mr. Haggard is welcome to his denials and his staunch defenders. It's expected, really. It has become a pattern: First the blanket denials, then the outraged defence by faithful friends, and finally the tearful confession.
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'berto
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Posted: Nov 02, 2006 16:01 Post subject:

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LOL... a description of Haggard's bath house... er... "church"...

Quote:
The atrium is a soaring foyer adorned with the flags of the nations and guarded by another bronze warrior angel, a scowling, bearded type with massive biceps and, again, a sword. The angel's pedestal stands at the center of a great, eight-pointed compass laid out in muted red, white, and blue-black stone. Each point directs the eye to a contemporary painting, most depicting gorgeous, muscular men‹one is a blacksmith, another is bound, fetish-style, in chains‹in various states of undress. My favorite is The Vessel, by Thomas Blackshear, a major figure in the evangelical-art world.[2] Here in the World Prayer Center is a print of The Vessel, a tall, vertical panel of two nude, ample-breasted, white female angels team-pouring an urn of honey onto the shaved head of a naked, olive-skinned man below. The honey drips down over his slab-like pecs and his six-pack abs into the eponymous vessel, which he holds in front of his crotch. But the vessel can't handle that much honey, so the sweetness oozes over the edges and spills down yet another level, presumably onto our heads, drenching us in golden, godly love. Part of what makes Blackshear's work so compelling is precisely its unabashed eroticism; it aims to turn you on, and then to turn that passion toward Jesus.

As John at AmericaBlog says, nahhh, nothing gay there...

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Feral
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Posted: Nov 02, 2006 16:05 Post subject:

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Bah... a Democratic shill. Termites infest more than log cabins, you know. They also enjoy dining on suburban ranch-style houses.

However... Do you think it was them dirty pichurs that turned the preacher man's eye?
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'berto
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Posted: Nov 02, 2006 16:10 Post subject:

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Feral wrote:
Bah... a Democratic shill. Termites infest more than log cabins, you know. They also enjoy dining on suburban ranch-style houses.

You said it... don't blame US when the Google 'bots pick up on it...

Anyways, who cares if he's a Stonewall Scorpion? It's still funny...

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Feral
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Posted: Nov 02, 2006 16:22 Post subject:

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Very funny.

Say... do you think we might get exterminator ads if we say termites often enough?
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Feral
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Posted: Nov 02, 2006 20:51 Post subject:

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Haggard steps down amid gay affair inquiry

Quote:
Ted Haggard, one of the most prominent evangelical pastors in the nation, resigned today as president of the National Association of Evangelicals amid allegations that he carried on a three-year sexual relationship with a male prostitute.

Haggard, founder of the 14,000-member New Life Church, has denied the accusations but said in a statement released by the church today that he could "not continue to minister under the cloud created by accusations made on Denver talk radio this morning."

He has placed himself on administrative leave pending investigation, spiritual counsel and a decision by the church's board of overseers, the church's legal counsel said. Haggard founded the church in 1985.

Now, of course this resignation is not an admission of guilt -- it's just required by the bylaws when an allegation like this is made. Really.

Quote:
Today, Jones showed the Denver Post an envelope addressed to him from "Art," a name Jones says Haggard used - sent from an address in Colorado Springs. Jones said the envelope came to him with two $100 bills inside.

Jones also played a recording of a voicemail left for Jones from "Art." Jones refused to reveal what the topic of the voicemail was about because there could be legal problems and he wants to consult with an attorney.

"Could be?" Yah... get on that attorney thing. Prostitution is not legal in Colorado.
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'berto
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Posted: Nov 03, 2006 04:46 Post subject:

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Apparently, this is not the first time this issue has been raised...

Quote:
Whitworth said that while he directed Ground Zero about a decade ago, he received a 10- to 12-page letter that accused Haggard of having a sexual affair with a man. Whitworth said it was not his policy to use unsubstantiated claims, and he believes he threw the letter away.

"The interesting thing is Ted Haggard called me and asked me if I had received such a letter, and we had a conversation. I said, 'Ted, I don't go for character assassination."'

[...]

Ryan Acker, executive director of the Pikes Peak Gay and Lesbian Center, said... "Whether or not Ted is gay, as the allegations say, I think today he is facing the same ridicule that gays and lesbians face every day, in part because of the teachings that have come from his church," Acker said.

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'berto
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Posted: Nov 03, 2006 05:36 Post subject:

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Apparently, Haggard has admitted to "some of the claims"

Quote:
A sudden about-face in the scandal facing New Life Church's pastor.

After Pastor Ted Haggard went public Wednesday night denying allegations of a homosexual affair, senior church officials told KKTV 11News Thursday evening, Pastor Ted Haggard has admitted to some of the claims made by a former male escort. The church's Acting Senior Pastor, Ross Parsley, tells KKTV 11 News that Pastor Haggard has admitted to some of the indiscretions claimed by Mike Jones, but not all of them.

And apprently, he's not under investigation by his own church:

Quote:
Right now, the situation is under investigation by an independent panel of leaders from four outside churches. The leaders are from Colorado Springs, Larkspur, Westminster and Louisiana. The panel's role is to decide if Haggard will be exonerated, released from his duties or restored to his pastorship.

Raw Story adds this background:

Quote:
The Rocky Mountain News described Haggard as a "giant of the conservative Christian movement, with direct access to President Bush."

In May 2005, Harper's Magazine ran a piece on Haggard reporting that the pastor talked "to President George W. Bush or his advisers every Monday." Harper's also noted that when he was asked why Bush "had not apologized for the false assertions used to justify the Iraq war, or for the dishonest smears marshaled on his campaign's behalf," Haggard replied:

Quote:
I think if you asked the President these questions once he's out of office, he'd say, 'You're right. We shouldn't have done it.' But right now if he said something like that, well, the world would spin out of control! ... Listen, I think [we Christian believers] are responsible not to lie, but I don't think we're responsible to say everything we know.

US News & World Report revealed on July 20, 2005 that Haggard received a call from the White House just before the announcement that Judge John Roberts would be nominated by President Bush to the Supreme Court. Haggard "was given an indication that Roberts 'would have respect for precedent but that precedent would not have the same weight as the Constitution itself,' perhaps signaling the nominee's stance on [Roe v. Wade]."

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Feral
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Posted: Nov 03, 2006 08:00 Post subject:

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Quote:
Apparently, Haggard has admitted to "some of the claims"

First the blanket denials, then the outraged defence by faithful friends, and finally the tearful confession. People think I make this crap up.

"Some of the claims" would be the more bizarre allegations that Mr. Haggard did meth. The content of the voice-mails suggests that Jones was his dealer. One wonders what the letter is about.
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'berto
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Posted: Nov 03, 2006 14:42 Post subject:

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Well, now it's methamphetamine and a massage, apparently...

Quote:
Evangelist Ted Haggard admitted Friday that he bought methamphetamine and received a massage from a gay prostitute who claims he was paid for drug-fueled trysts by the outspoken gay marriage opponent.

[...]

He denied the sex allegations but told reporters outside his home that he did buy the meth because he was curious, but he said he threw it away.

"I bought it for myself but never used it," he said. "I was tempted, but I never used it."

[...]

Haggard said he did get a massage from Jones after being referred to him by a Denver hotel.

Is "meth and a massage" the fundie equivalent of "dinner and a movie"?

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Feral
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Posted: Nov 03, 2006 18:30 Post subject:

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Quote:
"I bought it for myself but never used it," he said. "I was tempted, but I never used it."

Interesting story... kind of like "I didn't inhale." It is, of course, entirely possible that he's telling the truth, in which case I assume that he has already sent off hair samples to demonstrate the veracity of his claim. After all, he either did meth or he did not. Mr. Jones' allegations of actually having witnessed him doing so are needless elaborations. Whether or not Mr. Haggard has used methamphetamine can be tested for. I understand some fundie parents (and not so fundie ones) test their own children for drug use.

Mr. Haggard will have to excuse me if I decline to accept his unsupported word on this matter. I am not by nature a trusting man. Then again, Mr. Haggard doesn't have to prove anything to me at all.

In other news, Mr. Jones didn't do all that well on his polygraph test.

Quote:
Ted Haggard's accuser failed a polygraph test early this morning about the truthfulness of his accusations that he had had a three-year homosexual affair with the influential Colorado Springs minister.

The test was given to Michael Jones, 49, an admitted male prostitute, who made the allegations on the Peter Boyles Show on radio station KHOW Thursday morning.

The shocking allegations were denied by Haggard, who told KUSA-9News he never took part in a homosexual affair and had always been faithful to his wife, with whom he has 5 children.

So Boyles invited Jones to take a polygraph test at 5 a.m. this morning.

The test administrator, John Kresnik, said Jones' score indicated "deceptions" in his answers. However, Kresnik said he doubted the accuracy of the test he administered because of the recent stress on Jones and his inability to eat or sleep, according to KHOW producer Greg Hollenback.

Of course, polygraphs are good for very little. Their unreliability is sufficiently notorious that they are inadmissible as evidence in court and many states have outlawed their use by businesses. I means about as much that he failed the test as it would if he passes the next one -- nothing.
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'berto
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Posted: Nov 03, 2006 20:32 Post subject:

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Feral wrote:
In other news, Mr. Jones didn't do all that well on his polygraph test.

Quote:
Ted Haggard's accuser failed a polygraph test early this morning about the truthfulness of his accusations that he had had a three-year homosexual affair with the influential Colorado Springs minister.

It's interesting that the Denver Post characterizes it as a "failure"... the report on 365gay.com phrases it this way:

Quote:
A lie detector test taken Friday morning by Jones was "inconclusive".

The test was administered live on a KHOW morning show after Jones agreed Thursday to take it.

The man who administrated the test, John Kresnik, said it indicated "deceptions" in Jones' answers, but added that was likely due to the recent stress on Jones and his "inability to eat or sleep".

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Feral
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Posted: Nov 03, 2006 21:06 Post subject:

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The problem with the entire issue of polygraphs is that they are about as reliable as tarot card readings. Actually, tarot card readings are a tad MORE reliable. Neither are commonly accepted forms of evidence.

Another problem with with this case is the peculiar prejudices people bring to it. Is Mr. Haggard's word to be believed more because he is an evangelical preacher or less? Is there something specific about sex work that makes Mr. Jones' version of events immediately suspect?

I sympathize with Mr. Haggard's difficult position here... proving a negative is rather difficult. Just what evidence can he possibly produce that would lend credibility to this tale that he bought meth but threw it away, got a massage from Mr. Jones but didn't have sex with him? Mr. Jones has already produced quite enough evidence to suggest that his version of events is at least somewhat grounded in reality. Mr. Haggard has offered only his denials.

Curiously, $100 or $200 dollars, the amounts alleged by Mr. Jones, would buy roughly 1 or 2 grams of meth in Denver (according to the White House anyway). I am given to understand that this is really quite a lot of meth for someone who claims to be inexperienced.
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Feral
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Posted: Nov 03, 2006 22:10 Post subject:

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Holy crap. Apparently all it takes to chivvy drug treatment ads out of the Gairies is to say "meth" ten times.
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'berto
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Posted: Nov 04, 2006 19:12 Post subject:

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Disgraced pastor fired by church

Quote:
Embattled Evangelical Rev. Ted Haggard, who admitted yesterday to purchasing methamphetamines and soliciting a 'massage' from a gay escort, has been removed from his position at the New Life Church, according to a statement released by the church on Saturday.

While Haggard announced a leave of absence from the New Life Church on Friday, he was officially fired by the church board Saturday afternoon.

Excerpts from the New Life Church statement:

Quote:
"We, the Overseer Board of New Life Church, have concluded our deliberations concerning the moral failings of Pastor Ted Haggard. Our investigation and Pastor Haggard's public statements have proven without a doubt that he has committed sexually immoral conduct.

The language of our church bylaws state that as Overseers we must decide in cases where the Senior Pastor has "demonstrated immoral conduct" whether we must "remove the pastor from his position or to discipline him in any way they deem necessary."

In consultation with leading evangelicals and experts familiar with the type of behavior Pastor Haggard has demonstrated, we have decided that the most positive and productive direction for our church is his dismissal and removal.In addition, the Overseers will continue to explore the depth of Pastor Haggard's offense so that a plan of healing and restoration can begin.

Pastor Haggard and his wife have been informed of this decision. They have agreed as well that he should be dismissed and that a new pastor for New Life Church should be selected according to the rules of replacement in the bylaws. That process will begin immediately in hopes that a new pastor can be confirmed by the end of the year.

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Feral
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Posted: Nov 04, 2006 19:53 Post subject:

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Quote:
Our investigation and Pastor Haggard's public statements have proven without a doubt that he has committed sexually immoral conduct.

Interesting.

Taken at face value, Mr. Haggard's "public statements" amount to buying meth and paying for a massage -- neither of which are "sexually immoral conduct" -- and firm denials of the sexual allegations against him. Of course, there are more than a few people who don't give any credence at all to his denials. And now Mr. Haggard's church says the matter is proven without a doubt.

Huh.

The statement reprinted by Raw Story also includes

Quote:
A letter of explanation and apology by Pastor Haggard as well as a word of encouragement from Gayle Haggard will be read in the 9:00 and 11:00 service of New Life Church.

Cue the Tearful Confession®.

There have been, of late, a great many voices calling for pity, for charity, for compassion -- not only for Mr. Haggard, but for his wife and children. They certainly have my pity -- all seven of them. I can readily imagine what they are going through. Of course, it is not lost on me for one minute where the source of their discomfiture lies. Mr. Haggard did what Mr. Haggard did. If he does not like the consequences, he should have reconsidered his actions. The "media" is supposed to be ashamed of reporting these "rumors" (which now it seems have been declared facts proven beyond doubt). Mr. Jones is supposed to be ashamed of ratting out his client (if client Haggard was). Nasty people like me are supposed to be ashamed for gloating.

I won't.

I have been reminded that as homophobic preachers go, there are much, much worse than Ted Haggard... and it's true: there are. It doesn't matter. Murderers don't get extra credit because they are not serial-killers. They don't get more credit still for being guilty of homicide instead of genocide. They're still murderers.

Whenever I feel the least bit of sympathy for Mr. Haggard, I stop and consider this question: How many gay teenagers are dead today specifically because of Ted Haggard? I don't know the answer to that question. There's probably no way of knowing the answer to it. Still, in my heart, I am quite certain the answer is not "zero".
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'berto
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Posted: Nov 04, 2006 23:01 Post subject:

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Mr. "Family Values" discussed his purchase of crystal meth and getting a massage from a gay hooker in tee-vee interview, in front of his kids

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Feral
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Posted: Nov 05, 2006 03:49 Post subject:

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Accuser: I didn't aim to ruin pastor

Quote:
The prostitute who went public with allegations of gay sex and drug use with the Rev. Ted Haggard said he was saddened to learn Saturday the popular pastor had been fired.

"I hadn't heard that," Michael Forest Jones said. "I didn't want to ruin his life or his family's life."

Jones, 49, was reached on his cellphone as he arrived at Denver International Airport from a trip to New York, where he had just finished one of his numerous media appearances over the past few days talking about Haggard's alleged indiscretions.

Really?

That's just plain not in touch with reality. What possible other outcome could there have been?
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Feral
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Posted: Nov 05, 2006 13:32 Post subject:

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Fired evangelical leader apologizes

Quote:
COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. (AP) — Less than 24 hours after he was fired from the pulpit of the evangelical megachurch he founded, the Rev Ted Haggard confessed to his followers Sunday that he was guilty of sexual immorality.

In a letter that was read to the congregation of the New Life Church by another clergyman, Haggard apologized for his acts and requested forgiveness.

"I am so sorry for the circumstances that have caused shame and embarrassment for all of you," he said, adding that he had confused the situation by giving inconsistent remarks to reporters denying the scandal.

"The fact is I am guilty of sexual immorality. And I take responsibility for the entire problem. I am a deceiver and a liar. There's a part of my life that is so repulsive and dark that I have been warring against it for all of my adult life," he said.

Quote:
In his letter, Haggard said "the accusations made against me are not all true but enough of them are that I was appropriately removed from his church leadership position."

The full text of Mr. Haggard's letter is here.
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'berto
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Posted: Nov 06, 2006 14:57 Post subject:

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Fired church leader blasts homosexuality in "Jesus Camp" movie

Quote:
In one scene of the film, which follows a group of children as they develop evangelical Christian beliefs, directors Heidi Ewing and Rachel Grady visit Haggard's 14,000-member New Life Church in Colorado Springs, Colo. He tells the vast audience, "We don't have to debate about what we should think about homosexual activity. It's written in the Bible."

Then Haggard looks into the camera and says kiddingly: "I think I know what you did last night," drawing laughs from the crowd. "If you send me a thousand dollars, I won't tell your wife."

Later, another joke for the filmmakers: "If you use any of this, I'll sue you."

[...]

Haggard has disputed the way he's portrayed in Jesus Camp, saying on his Web site (in a posting that since has been removed) that the filmmakers shot for hours at his church and only used the parts in which he was playing with negative stereotypes.

"You can expect to learn as much about the Catholic Church from Nacho Libre as you can learn about evangelicalism from Jesus Camp," he wrote. Ewing and Grady say Haggard is the only one who has complained about the way he was depicted in the film.

Jesus Camp also shows Haggard speaking to an aspiring young preacher named Levi, asking him whether people listen to him because he's a kid or because he has something to say. His advice: "Use your cute-kid thing until you're 30, and by then you'll have good content."

Grady said that when she first heard about the accusations against Haggard, "I was shocked but I was not surprised in any way because he did come across as somewhat of a hypocrite even in our movie ‹ in a smaller way, of course. He was so cynical in that exchange with that child in our movie, it was odd and it popped out."

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Posted: Nov 06, 2006 17:01 Post subject:

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?
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'berto
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Posted: Jan 30, 2007 09:30 Post subject:

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Haggard's trick visits Haggard's church to receive thanks from fundies

Quote:
The former male prostitute whose accusations against New Life Church founder Ted Haggard led to Haggard's dismissal as pastor has paid a visit to the megachurch.

Mike Jones, who has a forthcoming book, told The Denver Post that several people shook his hand during the visit Sunday and told him, "God bless you."

"I had read a lot about the church, but there's nothing like seeing it for yourself," Jones told the paper. "It wasn't to rub anyone's face in it by any means. I was wanting to get some perspective, to see where they are coming from, what the magnet is."

[...]

Jones visited on Sunday with members of a New York-based theater troupe, The Civilians, who are researching a project on evangelicals. Church leaders knew about the visit beforehand. Associate pastor Rob Brendle saw Jones in the foyer.

"I told Mike, 'I don't want to impose my religious beliefs on you, but I believe God used you to correct us, and I appreciate that,'" Brendle said. "The church's response to him was overwhelmingly warm. One of the wonderful and enduring truths of Christianity is to love people the world sets up to be your enemies."

The world sets up to be your enemies?! He's talking as if HE is the aggreived party here, as if HE was being attacked, maligned and slandered all the time. The world sets up as enemies?!?! These assholes set THEMSELVES up as the enemy of queers. What fukkin' CHEEK!

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Feral
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Posted: Jan 30, 2007 13:15 Post subject:

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Quote:
The world sets up to be your enemies?! He's talking as if HE is the aggreived party here, as if HE was being attacked, maligned and slandered all the time. The world sets up as enemies?!?! These assholes set THEMSELVES up as the enemy of queers. What fukkin' CHEEK!

You should think on this point of view. Consider what it means (apart from and as a separate issue from the fact that this view inherently causes offense). I've heard it rephrased maybe a dozen times over the years and I do believe that it is a sincerely held view.

It is not often that your enemies will honestly tell you these things.

Just what does it mean that this church (and quite a few more very much like it) believes that the world has set Jones up to be their enemy, that this word "world" is just a euphemism for 'god'? Of course he's talking as if HE is the aggrieved party. In his mind he actually IS the aggrieved party. In my own mind, he's so full of shit that I can smell it from here, but I can acknowledge that he thinks that he is right... in fact, KNOWS that he is right.

This is the fault-line, the point at which any negotiation will have to begin. What peace can be made here? I don't see any. A truce of some sort (that will hold or fail depending entirely on just how much 'doubt' can enter into this peculiar knowledge that the world has set us up to be their enemies) perhaps, with astonishing effort. I really fail to see the point of either option.
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But what I drew from the water by the pond-side, that I reserve.
I will give of it, but only to them that love as I myself am capable of loving.

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'berto
Resident Blabbermouth

Joined: 28 Jun 2006
Posts: 592

Posted: Feb 17, 2007 04:11 Post subject:

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Church struggles to move on after Haggard

Yes, let's just put all that... unpleasantness... well... back here in the deepest, darkest corner of this closet, in this strongbox. And stack all these old National Geographics on top of it...

Quote:
Leaders of New Life Church will hold what they're calling a "day of hope" Sunday to discuss the claims of drug use and gay sex that led to the downfall of founding pastor Ted Haggard.

"What we have in mind for that Sunday is to give some closure to our congregation from this difficult time and also some perspective on the road ahead for the Haggard family as they enter this season of restoration," said Rob Brendle, an associate pastor.

... but we're still gonna keep callin' homos evil... and curin' kids of their homosexual afflictions. Oh boy, you betch'a we're gonna keep that up! Any "KC" or "A&F" duds show up on any of these kids, and we'll have 'em in intensive religious restraint therapy so fast-- what? No, we're gonna leave all the Big Gay Art decorating the church up... why?

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WShade
Doesn't Talk Much

Joined: 23 Jan 2007
Posts: 10

Posted: Feb 17, 2007 06:13 Post subject:

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All I can say is...fuck him! Oops...someone already has.
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Feral
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Joined: 27 Jun 2006
Posts: 1584
Location: Right next to where the trees claw at the windows.
Posted: Feb 17, 2007 12:57 Post subject:

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*Snerk*

Indeed, yes. Though why any reported ever asked what the two of them got up to is beyond me. The thought gives me the shudders. But then, I clicked the link on the story, and read it... every word.

Now I've gone and creeped myself out.
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But what I drew from the water by the pond-side, that I reserve.
I will give of it, but only to them that love as I myself am capable of loving.

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MonkeyBoy
Rather Chatty

Joined: 27 Jun 2006
Posts: 316
Location: Where the trees claw at the windows.
Posted: Feb 19, 2007 03:09 Post subject:

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Church Investigation Finds It Was Worse Than They'd Thought:

Quote:
The Rev. Larry Stockstill of Baton Rouge, La., an overseer, read a letter describing results of "extensive fact-finding" into Haggard's claim he had long struggled with a "dark side."

"We have verified the reality of that struggle through numerous individuals who reported to us firsthand knowledge of everything from sordid conversation to overt suggestions to improper activities to improper relationships," Stockstill said. "These findings established a pattern of behavior that culminated in the final relationship in which Ted was, as a matter of grace, caught."

LOL Getting ratted out by your hustler/dealer is 'a matter of grace' to these freaks? It... is... to... laugh.

The news begs a question, however: why was it the gay guy who spoke up while the squeaky-clean Christers kept silent?
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Feral
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Joined: 27 Jun 2006
Posts: 1584
Location: Right next to where the trees claw at the windows.
Posted: Feb 19, 2007 09:47 Post subject:

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MonkeyBoy wrote:
The news begs a question, however: why was it the gay guy who spoke up while the squeaky-clean Christers kept silent?

Trick question, right? I mean, the notion that a pack of Christers is less honest and less forthcoming (about nonsensical rules that they made up themselves) than a gay escort is a little obvious. Clearly "squeaky-clean" means something quite different in that dialect of English.
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But what I drew from the water by the pond-side, that I reserve.
I will give of it, but only to them that love as I myself am capable of loving.