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Post subject:
 Posted: Aug 03, 2007 - 12:05 PM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2006
Posts: 1195
Location: Valhalla Mountains, British Columbia, Canada
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| Well, a lot of these lame-brains don't think we *have* a culture... |
_________________
"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 03, 2007 - 05:37 PM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2006
Posts: 1754
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berto wrote:
Well, a lot of these lame-brains don't think we *have* a culture...
Oh, yes... a lot of them.
I have noticed in recent years that this thing that would be called 'Canadian culture' does not differ all that much from 'US culture' -- Does Canadian culture exist? Further, I have noted that, while there are some notable differences between the culture in evidence in the Saar valley of Germany and the Ohio River valley in the US (the English you will hear spoken in the Saar valley differs from the English in the Ohio River valley almost as much as the English spoken in Mississippi to my ears), these differences are not all that substantial when examined closely. Perhaps it is US culture that does not exist. Then again, perhaps these supposed similarities are the thing that does not exist.
I know an Englishman who has been living in the US for twenty years or so -- he still manages to outrage the locals with entirely inappropriate verbiage... the effect is really quite rude. Many consider him to be something between a pig and an asshole. In fact, while he may be either, his offensive statements and importunate questions pass as idle and friendly banter elsewhere. (Of course, twenty years is a long time to cling to usages that offend for it to be entirely innocent). Yes, he's lived in the US for what many people consider to be a long time... he cannot be said to participate in the local culture to any degree. I've not inquired into his citizenship status -- the color of his passport could not possibly make him any less English.
I know a woman who many people would consider to be Vietnamese. She was not born in Vietnam, and has never been there. She was born in the US, and until she studied French in school, English was her first and only language. She knows a few words in Vietnamese, but then so do I -- neither of us can pronounce them correctly to the satisfaction of a native speaker. In the way that she speaks, the clothing that she wears, the foods that she eats, the things she chooses to do with her time she is indistinguishable from any of thousands of women of her class in the area. Apart from her genetic make-up, she is no more Vietnamese than I am.
It is possible to not participate in a culture. That would be one of the key elements of culture, after all; your culture can be defined (if you insist) as the set of all cultural attributes that you do not refuse to participate in. That one does not participate in a particular culture does not make the culture not exist -- it makes that person an outsider. |
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"If you want the freedom, the abilities, you have to find a way. Just don't be so passive. We are capable of so much more." -- Larry Kramer
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 03, 2007 - 06:28 PM
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Joined: Apr 12, 2007
Posts: 472
Location: NYC
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I would argue that there is no indigenous American (or Canadian or even Latin American) culture save the ones found here when the Europeans arrived. They didn't blend their cultures with the natives and create a new, hybrid culture as has been the case in many parts of the world. They imported the culture of Western Europe wholesale and repackaged it under their various national names .
The U.S. in particular marketed this, first domestically to absorb incoming immigrants (mainly, again, from Western Europe), and then it was exported all over the world as the "American" ideal. By which, one assumes they really mean the "North American" ideal. But that's another topic altogether.
Many would argue that there is no single, unifying, gay culture to be found worldwide. However, a relatively random examination of gay life in various cultures and at various times all over the planet will reveal rather strinking cultural similiraties among gays of all places. Suffice it to say that gay people have an inherent view of sex and sexual orientation that ecompasses ideas of manifest beauty, spirituality, and originality.
This is what heteros allude to when they say things like "You people are so artistic." Coincidence, training, conditioning? I don't think so. |
_________________
Each of us inevitable; Each of us limitless - each of us with his or her right upon the earth; Each of us allowed the eternal purports of the earth; Each of us here as divinely as any is here. ~ Walt Whitman
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 03, 2007 - 07:05 PM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2006
Posts: 1754
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Quote:
Many would argue that there is no single, unifying, gay culture to be found worldwide. However, a relatively random examination of gay life in various cultures and at various times all over the planet will reveal rather strinking cultural similiraties among gays of all places. Suffice it to say that gay people have an inherent view of sex and sexual orientation that ecompasses ideas of manifest beauty, spirituality, and originality.
Many would argue this -- and just why would there be just one unifying Gay culture? Is there one unifying straight culture? Even so... the thematic similarities really ARE striking. I'd be inclined to attribute them to neurology, but then I'm like that. Even so... just on a basic level of visual aesthetics... Michaelangelo's David is hot (he'll do, though his abs need work) and Leonardo's Mona Lisa is not. An artist roommate of mine found it most peculiar that I see Le Grande Odalisque as a picture of a really cool fan (and the pipe is neat too). He says, "what pipe?" It should come as no surprise that a Gay idea of manifest beauty will affect even the sorts of landscapes that look attractive. Some might even see a hint of "morning wood" in the subtle asymmetry of Hokusai's Aka Fuji. (Hell, some might say the actual mountain is more suggestive than graphic representations of it.)
Some changes are trivial and insignificant -- others cascade into a series of reciprocal changes that are utterly transformative. Some differences are minor and easily ignored and others are not. "An extra oxygen atom is just a small part of who I am; it does not define me" is not a true statement when the speaker is a molecule of H2O2. Just try making lemonade with a pitcher of hydrogen peroxide instead of hydrogen dioxide and tell me how that works out for you.
I would be willing to wager some Coral Sea Dollars on the fact that, were I to walk into a bar habitually frequented by Gays in Buenos Aires or Singapore, every head will turn (in unison) to acknowledge my arrival. The length of this glance will be diagnostic of my relative merits as an object of interest, and will be inherently longer if I enter alone. Not that entering such a bar would be a particularly good idea from a social interaction standpoint. The only way I would expect to duplicate this phenomenon in a bar habitually frequented by straights would be to breach some sub-cultural taboo. Hostile stares for outsiders are not uncommon in bars of any type. |
_________________
"If you want the freedom, the abilities, you have to find a way. Just don't be so passive. We are capable of so much more." -- Larry Kramer
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 03, 2007 - 07:21 PM
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Joined: Apr 12, 2007
Posts: 472
Location: NYC
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Quote:
Michaelangelo's David is hot (he'll do, though his abs need work) and Leonardo's Mona Lisa is not.
Still, you have to admit that Leonardo in drag and giving that "I just got porked" smile ranks as one of the finest gay works of art. |
_________________
Each of us inevitable; Each of us limitless - each of us with his or her right upon the earth; Each of us allowed the eternal purports of the earth; Each of us here as divinely as any is here. ~ Walt Whitman
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 03, 2007 - 07:25 PM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2006
Posts: 1754
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| Sure -- it's great art. She just ain't hot. |
_________________
"If you want the freedom, the abilities, you have to find a way. Just don't be so passive. We are capable of so much more." -- Larry Kramer
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 03, 2007 - 07:29 PM
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Joined: Apr 12, 2007
Posts: 472
Location: NYC
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It's rather small, La Gioconda. I think she intentionally made it small so no one would be able to "spook" her five o'clock shadow.
You know how sensitive the drag queens are about their make up. |
_________________
Each of us inevitable; Each of us limitless - each of us with his or her right upon the earth; Each of us allowed the eternal purports of the earth; Each of us here as divinely as any is here. ~ Walt Whitman
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 04, 2007 - 05:45 AM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2006
Posts: 1754
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LOL
It used to be somewhat larger -- it was cut down at some point. I neither know (nor care) how much, when, or why -- but 'tis so. |
_________________
"If you want the freedom, the abilities, you have to find a way. Just don't be so passive. We are capable of so much more." -- Larry Kramer
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 04, 2007 - 10:12 AM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2006
Posts: 1195
Location: Valhalla Mountains, British Columbia, Canada
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Gee, who could cut "La Gioconda" down to size? Some even bigger diva?
I am reminded of the famous put-down/riposte when Margot Asquith was introduced to Jean Harlow at some swanky engagement. Harlow kept mis-pronouncing Asquith's first name, despite repeated corrections (translation: she was being a bitch). Finally, after the umpeenth time, Asquith replied icily, "No, my dear, the "t" is silent, just like in "Harlow".
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_________________
"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 04, 2007 - 10:24 AM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2006
Posts: 1195
Location: Valhalla Mountains, British Columbia, Canada
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BTW... I love how, just when I am about to throw my hands up in despair that ALL of you guys are so much more intelligent, more erudite, more well-read, more discerning, more artistic, more thoughtful and creative than li'l ol' me, and what the hell am I even DOING on this forum.... someone* makes a snarky/witty comment that allows me a chance to play the smartass and retain my self-respect**.
* You're ALL bad for that (part of being a homo, I think), but Rain tends to take the wildest "mood swings" that way, I think.
** It goes without saying that I'm hopelessly overclassed by you folks at being a smart-ass, too. The only place I seem to excell is in a group of straights -- for obvious reasons... they're all handicapped.***
*** Newfies excluded. The are the singular most hilarious (and FRIENDLY) people ever, bar none. Go to Newfoundland, or adopt a local Newfie -- you'll soon agree. |
_________________
"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 04, 2007 - 07:53 PM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2006
Posts: 1754
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berto wrote:
Gee, who could cut "La Gioconda" down to size? Some even bigger diva?
Some sketchy research suggests that whether La Gioconda was ever a size other than it is currently is now a matter of some controversy. Assuming that it is true that the wood panel has been cut, Leodardo is said to have declined to hand over the painting to the man who commisioned it because he liked it too well (it's been known to happen even today). Later, he sold it for a large sum of money to the King of France. It was in the Louvre when the revolution altered the painting's ownership status. So -- who could cut such a thing? I would say the kings of France might just count as "bigger divas" than Leonardo.
berto wrote:
BTW... I love how, just when I am about to throw my hands up in despair that ALL of you guys are so much more intelligent, more erudite, more well-read, more discerning, more artistic, more thoughtful and creative than li'l ol' me, and what the hell am I even DOING on this forum.... someone* makes a snarky/witty comment that allows me a chance to play the smartass and retain my self-respect**.
Ahem. Knock off all that "despair." You're fine. Even were these allegations about intelligence, erudition, reading, discernment, artistry, thoughtfulness, and creativity to be true (and I challenge the veracity of each and every of these outrageous calumnies)... there are other worthy attributes, a lot of them. (Smart-assedness, for instance -- a highly favored quality in these parts.) |
_________________
"If you want the freedom, the abilities, you have to find a way. Just don't be so passive. We are capable of so much more." -- Larry Kramer
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 07, 2007 - 08:16 AM
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Joined: Apr 12, 2007
Posts: 472
Location: NYC
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berto wrote:
* You're ALL bad for that (part of being a homo, I think), but Rain tends to take the wildest "mood swings" that way, I think.
** It goes without saying that I'm hopelessly overclassed by you folks at being a smart-ass, too. The only place I seem to excell is in a group of straights -- for obvious reasons... they're all handicapped.***
It's the homo mind. In the midst of a ponderous and cerebral argument, something akin to ADD kicks in and makes the most bizarre and tangential connections. It's a form of hyperlinking of the brain that I have only witnessed among gay men and certain women. It's one of the many reasons why Harvey Fierstein considers gay people evolutionarily superior to heteros. In the midst of that very cogent argument he dropped a beauty of a slap upside the head to all heteros..."Let's face it, were it not for gays the typical heterosexual wardrobe today would be limited to a choice between a fig leaf and a grape leaf."
We're all born that way it seems. Also, "mood enhancers" go a long way to jump start neuron ignition.
BTW...what's the Homeland's policy on self-medicating for non-medicinal purposes? |
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 07, 2007 - 09:39 AM
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Site Admin
Joined: Aug 26, 2006
Posts: 440
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berto wrote:
BTW... I love how, just when I am about to throw my hands up in despair that ALL of you guys are so much more intelligent, more erudite, more well-read, more discerning, more artistic, more thoughtful and creative than li'l ol' me, and what the hell am I even DOING on this forum....
Yes-yes, you little coquette - you now sitting there and waiting that we all say how clever and smart you are.  In reality, this appearing "erudite" takes hours of intense Google-Fu to just eloquently throw in a sentence or two of Cicero, or even an allusion to a passage in Ovid's "Metamorphoses". Your single mistake is that you are on dial-up and can't compete. 
Rain wrote:
BTW...what's the Homeland's policy on self-medicating for non-medicinal purposes?
Honey, the Foundation's official policy on all controversial issues is... that there is no official policy on such issues. Age of consent, religion, bisexuals, self-justice against Gay foes, unnecessary self-medication - no official policy. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 07, 2007 - 10:58 AM
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Joined: Apr 12, 2007
Posts: 472
Location: NYC
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vanrozenheim wrote:
Honey, the Foundation's official policy on all controversial issues is... that there is no official policy on such issues. Age of consent, religion, bisexuals, self-justice against Gay foes, unnecessary self-medication - no official policy.
Oh, dear...you do realize the bisexuals will want their women. And they will breed. Unless we castrate them all. We could end up facing a hetero population explosion. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 07, 2007 - 03:18 PM
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Site Admin
Joined: Aug 26, 2006
Posts: 440
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| I shall add, perhapts, that the above said concerns the current policy - or the purposefull lack of such. This is not said the lack of policy will pertain till the end of times... But currently, such issues would complicate the discussions unnecessarily. As for bisexuals, one of our fellow nationalists (K6) speaks of part-time heterosexuals, if memory serves. Or were them "individuals with prevalently heterosexual tendencies"? I suppose that "true" bisexuals would have little reason and desire to abandon their (straight) women then. And, whom shall they have then as sexual partners, besides Gays? Think of it - lesbians can take the castration issue seriously, if they get annoyed. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 07, 2007 - 07:57 PM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2006
Posts: 1754
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Quote:
what's the Homeland's policy on self-medicating for non-medicinal purposes?
Yup... there is no policy. This particular topic DOES come up in conversation from time to time... usually in the context of tax revenues.
My own personal view on such things is fairly simple -- just as the man who serves as his own attorney has a fool for a client, the man who is his own physician is at the mercy of a quack. Even so, gifted amateurs almost always outperform trained professionals in pretty much every field -- they just aren't known for their dependability. |
_________________
"If you want the freedom, the abilities, you have to find a way. Just don't be so passive. We are capable of so much more." -- Larry Kramer
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Post subject:
Posted: Aug 07, 2007 - 11:11 PM
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Joined: Apr 12, 2007
Posts: 472
Location: NYC
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| Well, call me a duck and I'll gladly quack! |
_________________
Each of us inevitable; Each of us limitless - each of us with his or her right upon the earth; Each of us allowed the eternal purports of the earth; Each of us here as divinely as any is here. ~ Walt Whitman
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